bass management vs audyssey results

Hi all, hope you can help.

 

I have a Denon AVR-1911 and Boston acoustics Soundware 5.1 XS

 

ignoring the written spec regarding the frquency response of the speakers for now

 

the sub does not have a direct input - the max i can set the x-over on the sub is 180hz

 

after running audessey the avr is setting the xover for the satellites to 200hz

 

on paper (i know i should ignore this) the satellites are rated down to 150hz (manual says to set the avr to 120hz)

 

so...

 

should i trust the denon (200hz) or override and set to say 120hz

 

based on the current (200hz) setting and my understanding of crossovers......

 

the satellites will be 3db down at 200 hz and the sub will be 3db down at 180hz - leaving a bit of a hole

 

i've read that it's bad so set the crossover lower than the reported as audessey wont correct below the detected roll off

 

has anyone had a similiar experience, ignored and set to a lower x-over and found the sound is better?

 

thanks in advance

 

sam

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12 Comments

  • 0
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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Sam,

    If the roll off is being found at 200 Hz then moving the crossover to a lower value will have no effect.  Perhaps you could experiment with moving the speakers closer to the wall.  These small speakers don't have much usable output below 200 Hz and the "hole" you are experiencing is the biggest problem with cube/woofer systems...

  • 0
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    Sam Ashworth-Ubysz

    thanks for the reply chris,

     

    the satellites are already mounted on wall brackets so can't go any closer to the walls

     

    i'm led to believe if i override and lower the crossovers to say 120hz then i'll lose some    audyssey correction i.e. 70hz worth 

     

    don't get me wrong, the sound is damn good but would like the sub to be a little more 'transparent'

     

    s

  • 0
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    Rob Brooks

    Chris, Am i correct here in thinking that the frequencies in the "hole" as outlined above would be directed to another speaker that's measured xover is lower than the 200Hz of the satellite but higher than the 120Hz of the sub?

    Or is that information simply discarded?

    In that case my thought for an easy solution to remove the hole would be to upgrade the centre channel to a nicer, beefier unit that could reproduce those mid frequencies a lot easier.

    I'd still recommend an upgrade to the centre for everyone using these sub/sat speaker systems, I forget the exact percentage, but is't approximately 60% of the audio on an entire movie soundtrack from the centre channel?

    It's a significantly weighted percentage anyway 

  • 0
    Avatar
    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Sam,

    The biggest problem is not that you will lose Audyssey correction.  There is no content to correct!  The speakers roll off at 200 Hz and the sub rolls off at 180 Hz on the high side.  So there is a hole between 180-200 Hz that neither speaker can play.  It's not too big of a problem in your case.  There are worse situations where the hole is much wider.

  • 0
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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Rob,

    Yes, absolutely.  If you can change the speaker to play lower then it will blend with the sub better.  The center is in fact a greatly overlooked speaker.  It handles a huge amount of content and for movies does a lot more work than the L and R speakers.

  • 0
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    Sam Ashworth-Ubysz

    what puzzled me is that even after the above, in the parameter check / eq check in the avr, the lower frequencies appear to have been boosted e.g +db @ 63hz for most of the channels

     

    or am i reading this wrong and the eq has been upped by audyssey taking into account the response of the sub?

     

    thx

     

    s

  • 0
    Avatar
    Chris Kyriakakis

    No, that should not be the case. Audyssey creates separate EQ for the speakers and the sub.  I am wondering if there is a bug with the display of parameters.  Denon should check this on your unit.

  • 0
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    Sam Ashworth-Ubysz

    Thanks Chris.

    I did a bit of reading around and am i right in thinking the EQ settings page in the avr isn't really relevant after running audessey - i.e. the audessey curve for each channel doesnt necessarily relate/translate to what is shown in the avr page

    theres only about 10 bands and i thought auddyssey makes hundreds of corrections

     

    s

  • 0
    Avatar
    Sam Ashworth-Ubysz
  • 0
    Avatar
    Chris Kyriakakis

    It's a rather coarse representation of the several hundred points that the Audyssey filter uses to shape the response.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Sam Ashworth-Ubysz

    thought as much.

    however.

    you've posted elsewhere that audyssey filters as if the speakers are going to run full range

     

    if so that would explain why the simple eq in the avr is showing as boosting the lower frequencies (bit like an rta/parametric setup would)

    you  also say that the rollof is reported to the bass management in the avr to set the the crossover

     

    does this mean that the low frequency filter in the mains are then disengaged (i.e. below the crossover point) and handled by the filters in the sub channel.

     

    sorry for all the questions just want to get the best out of my setup

     

    to recap

     

    for the main channels, audessey eq's down to the (decided by avr) crossover point, then stops

    filters in the sub channel then take over for the frequencies coming from the above

    :)

    s

     

     

  • 0
    Avatar
    Chris Kyriakakis

    Audyssey filters will be calculated down to the roll off frequency that is found during the measurement.  So, the mystery still remains.  If the roll off is around 200 Hz there should be little action in the filter at 63 Hz.  Keep in mind that they don't just stop abruptly however.  It's a gradual roll off so maybe that is being exaggerated by the coarse graph.

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