Crossover frequency

I have an Onkyo TXNR807 receiver - Does Audyssey automatically set the crossover frequency or do I need to do that as part of the speaker setup.

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125 Comments

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Covers should be on during calibration if you plan to listen with them on.

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Domenico,

    This will happen if you made a change to the speakers.  For example if you had a speaker connected and then turned it off in the menu the calibration will be lost.  It will not happen if you just change the crossover.

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    Sunil Kumar

    Dear Chris ,gone through your comments to other members impressed by your explanation.

    so through of sharing my concern.

     

    I have Onkyo NR-609 rec and SONY HCD RV900D 5.0 home theater ,am using 5.0 speakers to connect to NR-609,without sub woofer what cross over frequencies to be set to center ,rear and fronts.

    and my front L and R got 2 drivers and 1 twitter ,and there is option in the avr for the type of fronts normal or Bi-amp.what should i set.

    to output best Movie experience give some inputs how to improve the listening quality by using 5.0 Old sony speakers with nr-609.

     

    Thank you Chris

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    The RS meter also has a tolerance... 1-2 dB is not bad.  If you trust it more than the Audyssey mic (have you calibrated the meter?) then you can adjust according to the meter.  Measuring the sub with an SPL meter can be quite inaccurate because it doesn't look at the frequency range the same way.  

    I wouldn't worry about the polarity of the surrounds.  It has no effect on the Audyssey calculations.  Just make sure the wiring is correct on the amp and speaker.

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    Giftsai

    Hi Chirs, I run again Audyssey last night I follow your all instructions and the result is perfectly right now. I really enjoy. Thank you very much.

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    @StevenD: The proximity of speakers to the walls can greatly affect their low frequency roll off.  So, it's possible that the fronts were found to roll off near 40 Hz.  In any case, moving the crossover up as you did is fine.  With MultEQ XT32 there is no added resolution in the subwoofer filters as there is with MultEQ XT and MultEQ.  The XT32 filters in the satellites and sub have very high resolution already.

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    SankDaDevil

    Hi Chris,

    Lot of info here and very helpful.

    I have a rather peculiar issue. Last week I purchased Onkyo TX NR609 which has Audyssey 2EQ. I did multiple rounds of full calibrations but there are these issues that still persist:

    1. Audyssey reports the distances of my surrounds incorrectly. Both the surrounds are equi-distant from reference sitting position yet it reports the right one correctly at 3FT and left one at 8FT.

    2. Audyssey reports cross-over for my center and surrounds incorrectly from what is mentioned in the speaker manual. It sets it at 40Hz for both center/surrounds whereas it should be 75 for center and 80 for surrounds. I believe setting freq cross-over lower than the manufacturer specified values can hurt the speakers. Is it true?

    For now, I did venture out in to the settings of my AVR and set all values manually viz. the distances and freq cross-overs. Yet, I would like to know the advantage of using Audyssey with or without manual intervention and the reason why all values are being reported incorrectly?

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    Theodore Kypriotis

    It is not possible to connect my Onkyo directly to the sub, since my z5500 doesn't support it. I agree that it is a bad idea, but i need it since i am also using it on my PC setup which is in the same room.

    Other than that, i am still trying to find where is the "live" sound when it comes to explosions

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Alex,

    There is little benefit in moving the crossover to a lower frequency.  MultEQ will not apply any correction below the frequency it found to be the roll off.  The only way to change that is to move the speaker closer to the wall, but there's really no reason to.  The content below 100 Hz is properly directed to the subwoofer so nothing is lost.

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    Steve J

    Please discard the IMAG0225.jgp. Other 4 snap shot show the current setup  

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    Michael James

    When you change a surround switch from Bipole to Dipole, do you have to rerun the XT setup?

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    Domenico

    Hi Chris,

    I restored the auto-setup settings and then changed only the crossover frequency and the Audyssey option in the menu is still there.

    Thanks again for your help.

    Domenico

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Sunil, if you have no subwoofer then it is impossible to set a crossover for the front L and R speaker.  You can set a crossover for the other speakers (C and Surr).  If you do, then the content below the crossover frequency you set will be sent to the front L and R.  But, if all 5 of your speakers are identical then there is no benefit in doing that.  The best improvement will come by adding a subwoofer.  Then the bass below the crossover frequency will be sent to the sub.

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    Michael James

    I tried switching the wires on my main speakers too.. They are Focal 918's.  Audyssey XT did not pick up the polarity change on those either.

    All speaker wires are going thru the walls adn I know they extended all the wires.  The amp is buried inside a built in cabinet and I can;t get full access to the back.  I thought maybe I would defeat Audyssey, set all speakers to stereo and try and find a test pattern  in the 40 HZ- 80 Hz range and see if I notice the woofers moving inward vs out and/or listen for distortion.

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    Rickard L

    Well, I would still call it a dip and not a roll off.

    Anyway, I

    1) changed the toe in of the suspect speaker, aimed pass the MLP,  and slightly towards the position where I measuered the dip,

    2) removed the bass plugs of the LCR speakers and

    3) widened the listening area 1-2 feet to the left of the "dip position" (which still was measured as well) and it changed my LR fronts from 150 to 90 and my center from 70 to 40. (LCR are the same kind/model of speakers)

    Too bad, I didn't have the time to do each change with 8 runs each to see what each change did but it will do for now! :-) 

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    Sameer Dass

    Hi Chris,

    I recently purchased an Onkyo TX-NR609 Amp and Energy (Klipsch) CF 50 5.1 speakers setup for my home theater. I ran the Audyssey calibration for my room, as per the advice in the owner's manual - 2EQ process.

    The query which I would like to ask is that the Audyssey calibrated the crossover for my Fronts, Center and Surrounds all at 40 Hz. I also have 2 subwoofers connected to the system, one a 10" Energy subwoofer from my 5.1 package and another Cerwin Vega one from my previous 5.1 package.

    The Energy CF-50 speakers have a frequency range of 39Hz -20 Khz. Even though Audyssey has calibrated the frequency range correctly, I find the sound a little weak on the midrange and lowbass. Do you recommend my upping this crossover setting to 60 Hz / 80 Hz..? Will my subs be able to generate better sound than the fronts if they are crossed over at 80 Hz instead of 40 Hz.

     

    Look forward to your advice.

     

    Thanks!

    Sameer

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    SankDaDevil

    So Chris, you are suggesting that I should SAVE the values as reported by Audyssey even though I know they are incorrect and should proceed to modify them only after SAVING using the AVR's normal menu?

    If you say that room correction filters can't be affected by user selection then how would my setting of distance/freq response before or after the act of SAVING affect it? If user action doesn't affect it then immaterial of if I make changes to reported values before saving it or after saving it shouldn't affect. Right?

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Javier,

    I won't be able to do better than Audyssey did when measuring your room.  That's the whole point of measuring!  If you followed the mic placement instructions here, then you are set to go.

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    Alex0925

    Thanks so much for the explanation, Chris!

    I'll leave it at 100 Hz then.

    Best regards,

    Alex

     

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Steve,

    This all looks right.  Does the volume of the test signal change as you adjust the master volume control? It's not supposed to, but if it does the master volume should be set to 0 dB when you test with the SPL meter.

    It doesn't matter where it is set during the Audyssey measurements.

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Yes.  The response is different at high frequencies.

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    Sunil Kumar

    Thank you Chris.

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    Michael James

    Chris, any theory on why its not picking up the polarity issues on any of my speakers even when I intentionally switch + and - ?

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    Rickard L

    When MultEQ finds the low frequency roll off point of the speaker, what kind of intelligence is involved?

    It must be looking at some other criterias than the roll off point, or?

    If I do the 3 mandatory measurements from the same position in the middle of the listening area, the crossover gets set to 40Hz for my Front speakers.

    If I measure all 8 measurements covering the listening area, the crossover gets set to 150Hz.

    Since the measurement position used when it got set to 40Hz is also included in the 8 positions, it must "know" that the speaker produces sound at 40Hz, right?

    I think I have found one side of the couch where my Front Right speaker has a dip in the bass and I gather that MultEQ has found that dip too severe to be corrected and  that is why it sets it to 150Hz.. Does that sound reasonable?

    I have the bass port plugged on those speakers, remove it and I would get more bass. Would it influence the crossover decision if the speakers produced overall more bass below 150 to take the fight and correct the dip?

    By the way, I do have XT32 now.

     

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Hi Sameer,

    It's perfectly fine to move the crossover up a little as you suggest.  However, since the processor in the 609 is not powerful enough to run the higher versions of MultEQ, you won't get an additional improvement in the subwoofer filter resolution. 2EQ doesn't apply any subwoofer correction.  It's hard to predict if you will get better performance in the 40-80 Hz range without measurements.  Why not try it?

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    Chris Kyriakakis

    Only #1 is possible.  You should make any desired changes to the delays, levels, and crossovers *after* saving the calibration.  

    Changes to the Audyssey room correction filters are not possible by the end user at any part of the process.

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    Steve J

    No, I'm using receiver's  internal signal.  

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    Steve Caliendo

    Hi Chris,
    In a recent post from Alex0925, he asked you about his center channel whose manual indicated a crossover setting of
    60Hz yet Audyssey determined that the crossover setting should be 100Hz. You said he should leave the setting where Audyssey found it because that is how the speaker is performing in that particular room. Plus, Audyssey would not apply any filters below the measured level, regardless of what the manual says.

    My question is this: If the general consensus is that humans can localize frequencies above 80Hz, wouldn't redirecting those frequencies, in this case 80Hz to 100Hz out of 60Hz to 100Hz, from the center channel to the sub, be noticed by the listener since the sub is typically placed in a different part of the room?

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    Steve Nguyen

    Hi Chris - Very informative thread.  My setup is a 4.1 system using an 809 with Magnepan MC1 fronts, MMGW rears, and an older THX sub.  After calibration the settings are 150Hz for the all fourn Maggies.  This seems a bit odd given that I have the fronts on a wall exactly at the height recommended Magnepan, no carpeting and not tables.  Sooo, I reset the crossover to 80 fronts, 100 rear, and the LFE 10 100.  Magnepan specs the MC1's to 80Hz and the MMGW's to 100Hz.  My sub theoretically only goes to 120Hz.

    I find the sound better after changing back, but I don't understand enough to know if I'm negating the benefits of the Audyssey technology. 

    Steve

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    Michael James

    Chris,

    After the calibrations were done, I went back and checked the db levels using a Radio Shack SPL meter, on Slow, C weighting and the Onkyo PR-SC885 test tones running the XT version of Audyssey .  I found my front right speaker to be 1-2 db below 75 db and the sub,  ranging between 71-73 db (the signal was varying up and down on the same test tone).  typically, should the sub be at 80 db or what are your thoughts?  Everything else was at a solid 75 db

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