Dynamic EQ and Reference Level

What is Dynamic EQ and reference level?

Have more questions? Submit a request

184 Comments

  • 0
    Avatar
    Joe Norris

    Hi Chris

    I have an Onkyo AVR with Audyssey 2EQ, what is the best IntelliVolume setting for video games? At 0 dB (Film Ref) my rear speakers sound much louder than my fronts while playing video games so it ruins the surround sound experience.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Joe,

    Unfortunately there is no known reference mix level for games so it's impossible to know what was used in the mix.  Furthermore, POV games move the action to the surrounds and so Dynamic EQ will not be compensating correctly.  It assumes that the content is mixed at the same level in all channels.  My suggestion is to turn off Dynamic EQ for POV games.  It works great for ambience in games such as FIFA 11.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Simsaladim

    Hi chris!,

     

    I've got the denon 4311 with the XT32 equalizer.

    I use Dyneq and I love what it does, but when I use it, my subwoofer is boosted to a level where I can start to localize it. I use an 80 Hz. crossover for all sattelites.

    Do you have some advice for me?. Just turn down the sub level?.

    Thanks,

    Dimitri.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Dimitri,

    80 Hz is typically below the localization limit for human hearing.  Most likely, the cause is rattles or vibration that excites higher frequencies.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Joe Norris

    Hi Chris

    Even with Dynamic EQ turned off, in video games the sound coming from the surrounds is twice as loud as the fronts. I should also mention that my Onkyo system is hooked up to a PC for gaming, not sure if that makes a difference.

    Turning my Onkyo IntelliVolume to -10 dB seems to have solved the issue, at least in the one game I tested it on, things sound much more uniform now. Is that what IntelliVolume is for? Am I just going to have to find the best setting for each video game I play?

    Thanks for the help so far!

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Joe,

    Intellivolume is just a fancy name for "input trim".  It's lowering the input level for that source (the PC in your case).  It has no effect on the balance between fronts and surrounds.  The first thing to do is to check if the surrounds are calibrated at the proper level.  You can test that with the internal pink noise that the Onkyo provides and cycle it through all the speakers.  It should sound about the same level in the fronts and the surrounds with 2EQ enabled.  If it doesn't then the calibration may not have been done properly.  You need to make sure that the first mic measurement you make is in the exact spot of where you sit (at ear level).

  • 0
    Avatar
    Joe Norris

    I've run 2EQ about 5 times now, each time making sure the first mic measurement is on the spot I sit. 2EQ always sets my fronts to -11 center -12 (the max my AVR will allow) and my surrounds to -7. So I'm not sure if that's incorrect or Audyssey just doesn't work well for PCs since the user is so close to the speakers?

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Joe, it has nothing to do with PCs.  Audyssey is trying to set the reference level for the only known mix level: film.  So, if your speakers are really close they need to be turned way down.  It looks like the AVR is running out of range to do that.  Is there a volume knob on the speakers themselves that can be turned down or are these passive speakers.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Joe Norris

    They are passive speakers, they all hook up to the Onkyo AVR.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    OK, then you will have to make a manual adjustment if you want the surrounds to be at a lower level.  You can turn their individual levels down from the Speaker Setup menu.  Their levels are currently set to match the fronts, but that assumes that's how the content was mixed.  We can't make that assumption for PC games as there are no known mixing standards in that industry.

  • 0
    Avatar
    DeWayne Iverson

    Hi Chris,

    I have a question about the reference level being set to 0 on the master volume control after running the Audyssey setup.  I have the NAD T785 AVR, it has the Audyssey MultiEQ XT. Now this is what I don't understand; movie reference level is 85dBs and Audyssey when implemented sets this reference level for 0 on the volume master control. On my NAD receiver the reference level is reached according to SPL meter at -20 not 0. Postioning the volume dial to 0 would blow the windows out! So why is the the case in my setup? Also in regards to the offset control the NAD does not have just 3 settings ie: 5, 10, 15 but can be set at any number between 0 and 15. Is this correct. Thanks

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi DeWayne, something doesn't sound right about this.  How are you checking that reference level is achieved at -20 volume control?  Yes, reference listening levels are very loud.  Most people at home listen at around -20 dB.  So, is this a preference or have you measured the SPL with a meter?

    Regarding the Reference Level Offset, it was a feature implemented after the release of this model.  So, it's not available in it.  I am not sure what control you are referring to that can be set between 0 and 15.

  • 0
    Avatar
    DeWayne Iverson

    Hi Chris, sorry about the delay getting back to you. I did a quick recheck of the volume levels and my bad at -20 I am at 72dB on the rat shack sound level meter. so I guess that would be about where it should be, I could not crank it because wife was sleeping. Now the offset I am referring to is when I sequence press the Audyssey button I get 1) Audyssey Multi EQ = Audyssey 2) Audyssey Dyn EQ = on 3) Audyssey Dyn Offset = 0 through 15 not just the 5, 10,15 that was mentioned earlier. Is the the same offset you were explaining earlier?

    Also just for info. The NAD has the in the Audyssey Multi EQ selection the option for a NAD curve which I use for listening to music.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi DeWayne, what test signal are you using to measure this?  The internal test noise (band limited pink noise) in the NAD is at –30 dBFS and should be producing 75 dB SPL at the main listening position after you have run and stored the trims calculated by MultEQ.  

    I see what you mean about the offset.  Yes, the Dyn Offset is the same as the Dynamic EQ Reference level offset mentioned at the top of this thread.

  • 0
    Avatar
    DeWayne Iverson

    Chris I did not use a test signal for today's quick look see. I just had some programing on and did a quick volume check of the levels from this. I know this is not very definitive but because of circumstances could not do more at this time. I will recheck using tones tomorrow. Are the test tones generated by the AVR sufficient to check the levels? Or is using an audio setup disc be better for this ?

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Oh, I see.  No, sorry, it's impossible to do this with program material.  You have to use the internal test tones to verify the levels.  No need for a test disc.

  • 0
    Avatar
    robert Carman

    So basically tnis is how it works:

     

    0 Db = reference

    10 Db = louder

    15 Db = loudest

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Robert, I'm not sure I understood your post.  The 5 dB, 10 dB and 15 dB offsets for Dynamic EQ don't make the content softer or louder.  They simply tell Dynamic EQ something about the reference level that the content was mixed.  If you, for example, set the offset to 10 dB then Dynamic EQ will compensate less at the same volume control setting (as compared to the 0 dB reference offset).

  • 0
    Avatar
    robert Carman

    Hey Chris!! I was trying to understand it...I may have overlookedf something....I thought you said 15Db had the least amount of correction....does this mean volum correction? If so wouldn't that mean less correction = louder??

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Robert, I have a feeling you may be confusing Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ.  Dynamic Volume is in charge of making sure that nothing gets too loud.  The discussion here about Reference Level Offset, however, applies to Dynamic EQ.  Dynamic EQ is in charge of making sure that the proper bass balance is restored as you turn the volume down.  Content such as pop/rock music that is mixed at higher than film reference levels needs less bass boost.  That's what the 15 dB offset means: it's telling Dynamic EQ that the content is louder than film at that volume setting so "don't do as much bass boost compensation".

  • 0
    Avatar
    Thijs Busquet

    Hey Chris,

     

    I understand the reference setup, although all mixers must be deaf by now. If I play at reference level I'm at 82% of my amps power! This will literally make me dead in about 20mins. Why does it have to be so ridiculously loud ?

     

    Another question, not sure if this is the right topic. But I'm having some trouble with Dynamic EQ. My couch is on center between my speakers. It's placed against a wall and I always sit on the left side of the couch. So that was my first seating position for measuring. I then for the second measurement move the mic (have it on a boom/mic stand). to the right of the first position about 2 ft. third position is to the left 2ft. but that's not an actual listening position on the couch. The problem I then get is that when music in a 5.1 mix is transmitted stereo through the two front speakers it doesn't appear to be coming from the center position as I would like. The voices in music appear to be coming more from the right speaker. And that really drives me nuts. So to try and compensate I tried lowering the level of the right speaker to shift the center image more to the middle of my seating position. It works a little but not the way I'd like it to be. I've redone the automatic setup so many times, but I never get the result I'm looking for. Same goes for music in stereo mode (obviously). I like my center stage to be dead center on my listening position. Could you please give me some pointers ? And I have read all the guides on mic positioning etc. And the more measurements I take, the further the sound seems to shift. If I use all measuring positions (believe I have 6 or 9). The complete sound sounds like it's out of phase.

     

    Hope you can help me, I know it's a lot of text ;)

  • 0
    Avatar
    Thijs Busquet

    sorry above comment, first paragraph, dead must be deaf ;)

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Thijs,

    Yes, reference level is VERY LOUD!  That's why we developed Dynamic EQ.

    The first mic position determines the levels and delays for the speakers.  So, if you are not sitting in the center between the two speakers you should start the measurements in the off-center seat where you will be sitting.  That should apply a bigger delay for the nearest speaker and also a level drop relative to the other speaker.

    Taking more measurements does not have any effect on the level and distance settings.  They are only calculated from the first mic position.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Mmeredick

    Hi Chris,

     

    The other day I was listening to stereo mode on my Denon 5308CI, I have to engage the dynamic EQ in order to fully enjoy the music, they just sound full-bodied.

    Is it advisable to engage dynamic EQ for stereo listening mode?  If I did not engage, they sounded thin and honestly not suited for rock or R&B music for instance.

    Thanks for the response.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Absolutely! Dynamic EQ is not just for surround content. It makes real time adjustments for changes in human hearing at lower-than-reference listening levels.  These adjustments are needed for all content.

  • 0
    Avatar
    michalis

    γεια σου chris,

    i have onkyo 876.

    after calibration i measured the speakers and they are on 70db with the pink noise of onkyo instead of 75db.

    do you think i must increase all speakers by 5db or not?

    thank you

    μιχάλης

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Γεια σου Μιχαλη,

    This can happen for different reasons.  The SPL meter may not be perfectly calibrated or maybe not placed exactly in the same location as the first microphone position used for the Audyssey calibration.  In any case it's fine to change the trims if you want to.

  • 0
    Avatar
    Mark M

    My Marantz AV Receiver has the following settings for Dynamic EQ... can you relate these settings to your db guides ... 0,10,15,5

    Off

    On

    Light

    Medium

    Heavy 

  • 0
    Avatar
    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Mark,

    These are not the settings for Dynamic EQ.  They are the settings for Dynamic Volume.  That's a different technology entirely. It is designed to let the user set the volume to the level of dialog they want and then it makes sure nothing gets too soft or too loud, automatically.  You can read more about it and the settings above here:

    http://www.audyssey.com/blog/2010/04/more-than-just-volume-spikes/

  • 0
    Avatar
    Adam Brown

    Hi Chris

     

    I have the Onkyo HT-S5405 system. After running Audyssey it sets all my speakers to around -4db or -5db and the subwoofer to -1db. My problem is, with Dynamic EQ turned on, in very heavy scenes the subwoofer can really rumble causing it to distort and making a very unnatural and ugly sound. It can be eradicated by simply turning Dynamic EQ off or turning the subwoofer db down to about -5 or -6. What's the best solution?

     

    Thanks!

Article is closed for comments.